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MMA Elitism

Why is it people who have been watching this sport for longer than TUF 1 put down the opinions of “TUF Noobs”? Does watching the sport since Royce was the original Frate Trane make you necessarily more knowledgeable?If that’s true then all Pro Football fans should only listen to dead people from 1892.

I sat down and tried to figure out how many hours of MMA I have seen and it was a little staggering.

There have been 160 UFC events if you count UFN’s, TUF Finales and other odds and ends. Add that to the 68 Pride events and subtract say 20 that I may have missed for what ever reason. You have 208 cards with jus tthe big 2 promotions. Add in WEC, Strikeforce, EliteXC, Affliction, KOTC, Cage Rage, Dream, Sengoku, Bellator, IFL, Impact FC, YAMMA, Rumble on the Rock and whatever other random barn fighting championships I may have seen and that’s conservatively another 150 cards. So 208+150=358 lets times that by 3 hours and we get 1074. I’ll round down to 1050 hours of MMA just to be safe. So all told I have put in 1050 hours of MMA time. That’s not even factoring in TUF itself but since 90% of that show is not MMA I left it out. And the vast majority of this time came in a 2 year span from 2005-2007. Would you say I have little knowledge of this sport? It takes 250 hours of fight time to become an Airline Captain… how many hours does it take to surpass being a “Tuf noob”?

I’m not saying my case is the norm, far from it. Most people now who watch the sport on a regular basis have not watched even a quarter the amount I have. They are casual fans who really keep this sport running. But they too get shit on by the MMA Elite. Think about every time there is a decent card on PPV put on by a smaller promotion like Strikeforce or Affliction hardly anyone buys it. That’s because the number of hardcore fans is far far out weighed by the casual or even moderately interested fans. When I say moderately interested i mean people who regularly watch not only the UFC but catch Strikeforce and the other smaller promotions. Maybe the read a blog or two to keep up on the news. these are the people who have been pumping money into MMA. I know hardcores hate them but the guys who wear the douche bag “skulls and fleur-de-lis” shirts are the ones making the real numbers for PPV’s.

Sometimes it seems like these MMA Elites are in some kind of religion with how dogmatic they become. Fedor is Jesus and Dana is Satan and their final battleground is the forums. These people hold on to those people they have been following for years like Big Nog or Cro Cop and can’t grasp that it isn’t 2004 anymore and MMA has evolved past many of their dearest fighters. That’s not to say it isn’t fun to sit down and watch old Pride GP’s and remember when it was fun to crush cans.

This topic has been written about by way better writers than me and I’m starting to sound like Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh with my rant about elitism. I think it’s about time his sherdog mentality comes to an end; this is a sport with many levels of fans who need to band together not separate into different groups. Most other sports have their diehards and there casual fans but do you see them arguing about this in the way MMA fans do?

  • frickshun

    Who wrote this? Sounds like a big waste of time.

  • Reverend Clint

    I wrote it but i know paragraphs confuse you frick

  • glassjawsh

    way to ride my coattails clint:

    props on the write up though, better than usual

  • Reverend Clint

    i must have missed that since I dont read BE… ever

  • greenseed

    you have the DISGRACE that is impact fc, who paid very few of their fighters, and omit superbrawl and icon?! FOR SHAME. I know im being nitpicky but i hate slimeball promotions

  • Reverend Clint

    yeah i was looking at MMA organizations and remembered i watched that crap.

  • Bleach

    why am I constantly being referred to as a douche bag? I don’t hear of any other sports where the writers bitch about fans wearing club/team shirts (Maple Leafs, Habs to the Packers, Raiders, etc…). But since I like TAPOUT and WARRIOR apparel I’m labelled.

    Nice write up Clint, one of your better ones yet.



    Nobody really cares. This just sounds whiney, why dont you guys think im cool! look at everything iv watched! Just get over it. Probably 85% of all MMA (or should i say, ultimate fighting) fans started watching MMA post 2007. And thats fine.

    I have been called an “elitist” and wrongly, i believe. The only thing that grinds my gears is when people try to say pride sucked and ufc has always been the best and stupid shit like that. Oh and when people say the old legends really shouldnt be legends because they suck now.

    But frick put it best when he said this article is a big waste of time.

  • glassjawsh

    @ bleach – because skulls and blood and american flags on tshirts mixed with your tribal armband tattoo and your hair gel make you look like a douchebag

    just like scene kids with their girl pants and their casualties shirts or goth kids with their slipknot shirts, massive black jeans and powder makeup all have stigmas attached to them so does tapout/affliction/silverstar

    when you dress like a douchebag you have to realize that you run risk of being called a douchebag

  • cheese

    here i thought this was gonna be a cool blog but its just another bag trying to show off how big a hardcore fan he is. then the whole we are the world we are the children and lets band together crap. dude enough spend a little more time wrighting about the sport and a little less time worried about the fasion of the fans.


    Yeah im going to go with Glass here, if you were tapout your a fag. Tapout is not a team, you would of had better luck saying nike or some shit. Get over it, accept your homosexuality, or stop wearing the shirts.

  • Letibleu

    wrighting? lol

    We’ve wanted, so that our kids to have spoke, just as good of English as we done.

  • cheese

    i have been watching the sport since the clock wound up not down and it was not a sport just an event. who cares what the fans wear i think what really matters is whats going on in that cage not who wears what you guys sound like those dam shows my wife watches where they are more concerned with what people are wearing than the actual event

  • cheese

    writing that better little boy blue(letibleu)

  • Blackula Jonez

    Got into the sport in the fall of 08 after years of my friends being into it.

    The UFC is the top organization but I have no problems watching other orgs because i like watching fights period.

    And I usually just DVR and fast forward to the fights most of the time when watching TUF, but it is a good recruitment tool to popularize the sport even if it isn’t crowning new blue chip prospects who are usually just fighting their way to notoriety elsewhere nowadays.

  • Reverend Clint

    im not trying to say look at me im cool because i have seen x number of events. What you guys fail to read is im saying no matter how many fights ive seen im still a tuf noob to some people.

    im not trying to promote world peace or say all fans should sing Kumbaya but what other sport has fans comparing the amount of time or how they got into it? im trying to point out how stupid that is.

    oh and douche bag is the right term since 90% of the people that wear them are douche bags. that said i have 2 tap out, 1 affliction which i got for free, and some random other shirts. I wear them to be a douche bag.

  • Bleach

    @ Glassjaw – Than I’ll be a douche bag ( minus the tribal and hair gel)

    @ Yeahright – I’m not going to start a pissing match with you.

  • Simco

    Clint, you should read that link glassjaw posted. And really, read anything he posts where he tries to talk about music and subcultures because it’s hilarious.

  • glassjawsh

    @ simco – the only argument you’ve ever given to the contrary goes like this “durrrrrrrrr, you know nothing urrrrrrrrr I know this because i know everything hermmmm”

    the only references i ever made to subculture were the bad experiences i had dealing with chicago punks in the early 00’s. which, last time i checked, were uniquely my own.

    I didn’t try to make any rash or sweeping generalizations i just stated THE FACT that the punks I encountered were for the most part, asshole sheep who had no idea at all about the punk ethos or what they were doing and why other than wanting to “look cool, get drunk, and listen to the descendants” but still didn’t want you to dress like them or show up at their shows as if somehow not being initiated into the scene years prior made you a poseur and reflected upon your ability to skank or slam dance with the rest of them.

    i used to always tell friends that it was like they didn’t want to let people in because they enjoyed being different too much (even though they ironically all dressed the same and listened to the same bands)

    now you can either refute that statement, out yourself as a troll or GTFO!

  • kwagnuth

    Clearly you guys know nothing about mma.

  • P W

    “… it isn’t 2004 anymore and MMA has evolved… ”

    That’s almost completely fucking irrelevant. It’s not that simple. If it was, UFC 119 would have been most amazing event yet. ALL SPORTS are constantly evolving. Athletes are getting bigger, faster and stronger. But does that automatically equals BETTER?

    Also, going back and looking at 5 or 10 year old events to try to catch up is doomed – DOOMED I tell you. There’s no way you’re gonna get the same thrill now as it did for someone witnessing it live back then. Watch an old clip of Bob Beamon jumping 8.9 meters. You’ll go “that was pretty far” (because it is, even by today’s standards) at most, but the people who saw it live didn’t believe their fucking eyes. It’s the same thing with a Carl Lewis 100 m race. “He’s so slow I bet Bolt could’ve beat him running backwards”. Or an old black and white NBA footage. “Those guys couldn’t even dunk!”. Babe Ruth? “Fat fuck!”

    By the way, my favorite MMA event took place in 2005. Sadly. I wish it had been UFC 119.

  • subo

    The Dana/Fedor/forum line was really, really good.

    I don’t like patronizing orgs that treat their fighters/the sport like shit. Just makes me feel bad. Now, when I get around to buying that 500GB external hard drive, and people send me good linkies…

  • sandstorm

    rev i hear what youre saying. and i agree, bein only 21 years old i havent had the pleasure of following it since the beginning like some people, and yeah some are gonna say “well you couldve if you wanted to” but the fact is how was i supposed to know about it at that age? i remember the first thing i saw was a ultimate knockout tape and seeing that huge gash eastman got, and i was hooked. the fact is that the arguments over who is the true “hardcore” fan get us nowhere, and we need to acknowledge that anyone who is a fan, watches events, reads the blogs and websites is an important part of this sport, regardless if they started with UFC 1 or pride or TUF. as long as they are passionate about this, then that is what matters.

  • Symbul

    Do you feel like your opinion is worth less because you didn’t give blowjobs in truckstops for PRIDE tapes?

    I don’t feel that way, but some people love to elevate their status by ‘doing it before it was cool’. It’s not significant.

  • frickshun

    I have no idea what’s going on here. I’m not into fighting @ all. I found this site b/c I’m a big fan of pack animals like jackals, hyenas, lemmings, the Voltron lions & Hispanics. I’ve been trying hard to look past all of the fight talk so that I may forge a friendship with all of you. I wanted to fit in so badly that I bought clothing from such high-end designers as Tapout, Silver Star, Kill It, Red Nose, Extreme Couture, Jesus Didn’t Tap, Affliction & Jordache. I even signed up @ Tiger Shulmans to learn the fine art of cardio kickboxing!!

    Clint–>my comment is more referring to the fact that there seemed to be no catalyst for your post. Did something major happen this week that you felt it was worth addressing? Personally, I DID watch UFC 1 when it originally aired. Like everyone else in Brooklyn, I had an illegal cable box so I watched the 1st few. When I lost the illegal cable & the sport was getting banned…I stopped watching for years. Started again in the early 2000’s. The only people I call “TUF Noobs” are the people whose “opinions” are only what was fed to them by Goldy or Dana White. As long as you cockbreath faggots can form an intelligent opinion, I don’t give a shit if you witnessed live Keith Hackney’s thrashing of Yarborough, Gracie’s marathon match against Severn or the debut of the 1st UFC Pit Fighter…..Paul Varelans!!


  • agentsmith

    Let’s face it, MMA probably has more internet nerds in its fanbase than any other contact sport besides porn. No wonder there’s so much disdain for the “Tapout/Affliction douchebag” types, cause alot of the people who feel that way are the Comic Book Guy types. I mean shit, you ever seen a picture of Jeff Sherwood?

  • agentsmith

    Wow, where do you find Jordache these days?


    Once again, frick nailed it. Doesnt matter how long you have been watching, just dont be an idiot.

    And ill out piss anyone.

  • Mike219

    @glassjawsh your complaints about the Chicago punk rock scene stick in my craw a little bit. I think if you were really there, especially in the aughts due to the demise of the Fireside Bowl as a venue, you’d understand the need for secrecy as most of the smaller shows were in houses as opposed to clubs and that isn’t exactly legal. As opposed to crying about it you should have done the punk rock thing and started your own band or booked your own shows.

  • Reverend Clint

    PW my favorite events happened in 2005 and 2006 in pride but I know that the sport back then was different that it is now… same as football is different now than it was like 20 years ago. thats just how things happen. Evolved doesnt necessarily mean better, you must not follow biology. Just means better suited to its current environment.

    frick me and millertime were chatting last night about this subject. You are one of the enlightened old school guys and by old school i just mean old as fuck.

    I am 24 and basically grew up in the fucking boonies and didnt really get exposed to MMA until college/TUF. I had seen a pride and i think i watched a K-1 event when i was like 8 but didnt know wtf i was watching since it was at a relatives house and everyone was high as fuck.

    I did read glassjawsh’s article after the fact and it was pretty interesting.

  • P W

    Clint: Your first paragraph was pretty much a retelling of what I wrote to you.

  • P W

    I’d say it never hurts to know some history (which of course goes for any topic you’re about to discuss) especially if you’re about to make claims like “best fight EVER!” (random noob), “one of the most unique (sic) fights in MMA history” (Mike Goldberg at WEC 48) or “The golden age of MMA is now” (Subo, UFC agitator), or you’ll come across as ignorant. Or stupid. Or both. But if you’re gonna discuss let’s say the outcome of a recent fight, or the potential of a new, upcoming fighter, it doesn’t really matter. And being in the game a long time doesn’t help keeping all those generic guys on the UFC roster apart.

  • SpiderJerusalem

    STFU noob!

  • FiveBoltMain

    Cry me a river so I can go skinny dipping :P

  • Millertime

    Great work Clint. Congrats on the new job.

  • frickshun

    Clint sealed the deal on the new job by telling them he was a “head writer on a major sports news website with literally tens of dozens of people reading his stuff monthly”……then he gave the guy a rusty trombone.

  • Millertime

    “Clint sealed the deal on the new job by telling them he was a “head writer on a major sports news website with literally tens of dozens of people reading his stuff monthly”……then he gave the guy a rusty trombone.”

    Whatever it takes :)

  • Reverend Clint

    wasn’t a guy…. unfortunately

  • Rodriguez

    Ever notice how TUF noobs are the only ones who make the “it doesn’t matter when you started watching” argument? Just sayin’…